Men, Women, Intimacy: What Does Love and the Gospel Have to Do with It? A Principled and Practical Approach
by Michael A. Goodman, associate professor at BYU, PhD in marriage, family, and human development
This class was held in the Pardoe theatre in the Harris Fine Arts Center at 8:30 am to 9:25.
My notes:
Kristen's notes:
Key
⍰ Questions to think about later (presenter’s or your own)
⇥ First priority - Something I can implement this week
☆ Great idea
[ ] Executive summary - things I want to talk about with Zach or someone else
Notes
Popular approaches:
5 Love Languages
Observe the way they show love to others, what they complain about.
Color Code - Taylor Hartman
Red, Blue, White, Yellow personalities
Scriptural Counsel - based on values & character rather than personality
Matt. 12:34
D&C 88:124
D&C 136:23
James 1:19
We already know the key principles of communication. Why doesn't it work?
Hinckley - " Communications is essentially a matter of conversation...It seems to me that communication is essentially a matter of talking with one another."
Marvin J Ashton - If we would know true love and understanding one for another, we must realize that communication is more than a sharing of words.
Refuse to believe that they intended to hurt you when they said or did the thing that hurt you.
Don't impute ill intent.
By choosing to become offending, you are handing over your agency.
Marvin J Ashton - Family Communications, GC April 1976
The key to becoming a great it not simply skills or gender differences; it comes down to charity. Even if I lack the skills, I will become more effective as I go, because I care and want to learn how.
President Eyring - The Complementarity of Man and Woman: an International Interreligious Colloquium, Vatican City, November 18, 2014 - Selfishness/unselfishness
Men (and women) want to know they are capable.
Adam and Eve - Adam's reason for partaking of the fruit was different.
Men: If it matters how it is done, tell us before we do it.
Your husband is anxious to please you, but doesn't want to be caught being wrong.
If he already considers himself "good at it," your suggestions may be less than welcome.
When you ask, "Do you like it?," he may have little opinion about it.
Men want to be as close to "right" as possible.
Ingrained habits die hard. We can be understanding of each other.
Sharing what you want is an amazingly effective way of getting what you want.
Men want to be capable. When they have a problem, they want to be capable of solving it.
Men: all comments are null and void after 7 days; don't want to be held accountable for things they don't remember.
Details - we remember details when the issue matters to us.
Men are very good at distal issues; women are very good at proximal issues.
Men tend to be more utilitarian in their use of words.
I need to know you still think I'm attractive and capable. When we are dating and courting, we are very good at affirmations. If we are not careful, those begin to go down, the longer and longer we are in a relationship.
If you are ever going to do comparitives in a description, make sure you do it in a way that describes the other person as positive. (Priesthood vs. Women's meeting)
Problems stay within marriage (exceptions).
Men cry differently than women. Men know why they cry. Women may not know why they cry or whether they are happy or sad.
Romantic Intimacy
True love-making is always other-centered (not selfless). It brings us closer to Heavenly Father.
Tenderness and respect - never selfishness - must be the guiding principles ... President Hunter
The motivation behind love making needs to be other-centered.
Every single one of us enters marriage somewhat clueless; we don't know our sweetheart yet, and we need to learn and be humble.
The best source for help in your marriage must always be your spouse. - Lamb & Brinley, Between Husband and Wife, 3-5)
Between Husband and Wife book
Your spouse is not a book. They may not match the gender differences. The best way to learn is from them.
We are both trying to meet at the same place; we come through different doors.
Becoming one: Intimacy in Marriage - Stahmann, Young and Grover
Our differences are glorious.
Desire leads to arousal; arousal leads to desire
By this definition, up to 40% of women were sexually disfunctional.
Women are actually flipped.
Overgeneralizations that are true more often than they are false:
To husbands intimacy encourages a relationship; to wives a relationship encourages intimacy.
To husbands often a physical desire for closeness leads to an emotional desire for closeness; to wives often an emotional desire for closeness leads to a physical desire for closeness.
Husbands often immediate; wives often deliberate.
Husbands often focus on the physical; wives often focus on the overall relationship.
Husbands - touch is intimacy; wives - touch leads to intimacy.
Husbands often stimulated by seeing and touching; wives often stimulated by talking and touching.
Both men and women can be selfish in their approach.
Neither is perspective is wrong.
Myths:
Men are more "sexual" than women.
70% of the time, husbands want to make love to their wives more frequently than wives want to make love to their husbands.
Frequency of desire isn't necessarily an indicator.
Sex is somehow dirty or unclean - don't discuss it.
Whiplash
We have to learn to talk together and communicate.
You have to be in "perfect shape" to be sexually appealing.
Yes, be healthy and clean. Sexual satisfaction is always higher in marriage than out (research).
Two Key Differences
1. Men tend to compartmentalizations and women tend to view things holistically.
2. Sexual intimacy both leads to and is a result of intimacy as a whole...often (though not always) depending on gender
For the Men: key issues to consider
Your wife views intimacy differently than you do. We often project our own feelings onto other people; if they don't match the other person's feelings, you are in for a rude awakening.
"If you do what comes naturally when it comes to making love to your wife, most of the time you'll be wrong" (Becoming One...) Our spouse isn't us. We cannot come into love making in a self-centered way.
- The overall quality of your relationship will often (notice the last word) be the most important predictor of your wife's intimate desires and satisfaction. Most men don't connect cleaning garages with making love. "My husband is never so sexy as when he is cleaning the toilet." He wanted to do his part in that relationship, and she felt that. Pornography for Women Calendar - men, fully dressed, cleaning and doing chores
You need your wife's help to know how to love her. This can be truly terrifying to a man who wants to be the end all be all for his wife. He wants to be capable. This is where they need to break down this barrier. Women need to break down the mind-reading expectation.
There is going to be a learning curve. We are constantly learning about each other physically and emotionally. Be open.
The entire plan of salvation depends on a boy and girl liking each other more than a brother and sister.
"[Most] women value sex because it makes them feel loves as much as or more than because it is physically pleasurable" (Becoming One: Intimacy in Marriage, Stahmann, Young and Grover)
For the Women: key issues to consider
- Intimacy is often the best way and for some men the only way they can transcend the barriers which allow them to share the emotional and relational intimacy you desire.
If you do what comes naturally when it comes to making love to your husband, most of the time you'll be wrong.
When men feel sexually desired and fulfilled they are more able to focus their energy on other aspects of your marriage and life which are necessary. Heavenly Father has built into men the state of being twitterpated. They are focused intensely on you. When they are sexually satisfied, their focus can expand.
Men cannot read you and can't be held accountable for that which is not expressed.
Your husband needs to know he is pleasing you for him to be fully sexually satisfied.
Hormones influence behavior in men and women. Testosterone level dies in a man living in the home where there is a baby (doesn't have to be their baby). Heavenly Father knows that it would become a barrier to bonding with that child.
2 things that help men lower that barrier that prevents bonding: babies, and the love making that creates babies.
Touch me and die. How is it possible?
Heavenly Father built us so that we have to depend on each other; by depending on each other, both of our needs are met.
Books:
Sexual wholeness in Marriage
And they were not ashamed
A celebration of sex
Soul virgins
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